PCA has no problem with Pedophiles- Deleted 1st 2 posts

[kickasspodcast]

Hey Everyone-

Can you believe that PCA is ok with Pedophile Podcasters?

http://www.podcastalley.com/podcast_details.php?pod_id=9806

This is the 3rd time I posted a link calling attention to this.
I got a message from the ferf a day ago saying that I should
be patient and that they were working on the problem.

Well I am tried of being patient with Child Molesters and Nazis.

Screen Shot below. Better read this before Ferf Deletes this 3rd post.

http://kickasspodcast.com/pedoinpca.bmp

How about instead of censoring my free speech, and locking threads that actually garner real attention and traffic; How about you thank me for pointing out the fact that PCA has a Pedophile Podcast, that you had no idea, and that you will remove it immediately. Don't simply delete my thread and tell me to shut up. I am not breaking any PCA rules here but I will take a SS of this post too.

Jack B.

PLEASE REMOVE THE CHILD MOLESTER PODCAST FROM YOUR LIST

[FOSCO]

Let's see what the free speech dummies have to say about this.
Lots of people should be ashamed of theirselves for this one. :roll:

They have been here for weeks. That's F'n crazy.

Fosco

[SHITE.com]

Thanks for the link.

[radiofilibuster]

Very intriguing... and disturbing.

I wonder what kind of legal implications could arise from something such as this... for both the podcaster, and the podcasting directory who supports them after learning their nature.

[TINKOFF RADIO]

This would be a good question for a poll to get a read from the community that uses PCA. Anybody care to set one up so we can get a vote on this issue?

[Patrick]

Where do you draw the line and what should and shouldn't be allowed? As long as it's not breaking any laws, I don't think it should be removed from a directory of podcasts. People smoke pot on their podcasts and that's acceptable. It's also illegal.

I just don't know. I'm not saying pedophilia is right - it's sick and illegal.

[kickasspodcast]

Where do you draw the line and what should and shouldn't be allowed? As long as it's not breaking any laws, I don't think it should be removed from a directory of podcasts. People smoke pot on their podcasts and that's acceptable. It's also illegal.

I just don't know. I'm not saying pedophilia is right - it's sick and illegal.


There is, fortunately, no way to know if someone is smoking pot
or they are having a little fun with implied audio. Not to mention
I don't think its actually illegal to smoke, I think its only illegal
to possess, sell, distribute, or manufacture. I also think its worth noting
that most people have no problem with responsible use of cannibas.

However a podcast about "Childlove" is wrong in every way. People
always ask "Where do you draw the line?" That is a very easy question
to answer. You draw the line at people telling others its ok to "drag jews
from their bed and murder them" and child molesters telling people that
"its natural and normal to have sex with 10 year old boys." I don't think
that it requires too many brain cells to see the obvious difference in
vulgarity and what is natural offensive, with what is universally unacceptable
and what actively advocates violence.

Nobody (here) ever complained about
porn, off color jokes, or too many cuss words- but you obviously have a clear
majority that does not welcome the KKK or the Child Molseters of the world into the community. Once again- these directories are privately owned, the owners are in no way obligated to include any show they feel is over the line. I don't know of any directory that has suffered by excluding shows. I but I know of a few that have actually seen people leave because of what shows they did include. I am about to call it quits here at PCA. The voting system is stupid- it gaurantees 2-5 minutes of worthless "vote for me" time in nearly every podcast. It also does not reflect clearly on what people are actually listening to.

What I think its really ballsy is that Ferf deleted the 1st two posts I made about this yesterday, then writes me to be patient and that he is working on it, and then never deletes the listing and deletes MY 2 threads about it.

You wanna talk censorship? How about locking threads that make Podshow look bad and deleting other threads that make PCA look bad.

Get your shite together people- none of this helps you.
Did you really think that Fosco or I wouldn't find out about this
and call you out on this too? Shame.


Jack B.

How long until we all up and leave this bitch? Not long.


F_ck Podshow!

[Patrick]

I'll agree that threads have been deleted that criticize podcastalley.com and I don't agree with that. I do know where Chrs is coming from though, and it's hard to let things go that trash your site ON your site, so I know his struggle.

Anyway, if you can't prove peope are smoking pot, the same argument works for the pedophile cast. You can't prove a law is being broken. Also, as far as the KKK cast (if that's what it's called), it's everyone's right to have an opinion.

If you want to openly hate backs or jews or mexicans or women, then you have that right - it's on you.

[jimk]

Chris is all "Don't swear! Don't swear, it's OFFENSIVE."

SO IS PEDOPHELIA AND WHITE SUPREMACY>

That is so unbelievably hypocritical I hardly know where to start.. Deleting threads and posts that ask a simple question? What a pathetic way to do things.

Chris, it's a simple question: Why are you so worried about swearing being offensive but you personally protect pedophiles and white supremacists? Do you find swear words more offensive that f@#!ing a child or advocating the death of Jews and blacks?

[jimk]

Where do you draw the line and what should and shouldn't be allowed?

That weak-*** argument is bullsh...oops, can't swear, might offend someone. DEATH TO JEWS! There, now I'm acceptable to Chris and can be welcomed into the PCA community as wholesome and desirable.

Anyway, that line of thinking is weak. The line is easy; It's pedophiles and white supremacists. It's not "hard" to tell, it's mother @#$ing obvious. It's an easy line, morally.

Kid fiddlers and people who advocate the death of blacks and jews = no. See how easy?

Telling jokes with racial components is not the same as saying that other ethnicities are inferior and deserve violence done to them. The line is quite easy to see.

[Patrick]

I just completely disagree.

It isn't Chris' role to dole out morality or say what's right, what isn't, what crosses the line, and what doesn't.

This is a podcast directory. I think it should contain as many podcasts as possible. It has nothing to do with agreeing or endorsing any podcast. It's responsibilty is to be a complete a directory as possible.

I don't think Chris should be any more liable for listing and linking to those questionable podcasts than Google is.

Are you going to call Google and tell them to remove every link to anything that suggests a white supremacist mindset? Of course not - that's silly. But censoring a podcast directory, no, that's normal.

Booooo!

[jimk]

I just completely disagree.

It isn't Chris' role to dole out morality or say what's right, what isn't, what crosses the line, and what doesn't.

This is a podcast directory. I think it should contain as many podcasts as possible. It has nothing to do with agreeing or endorsing any podcast. It's responsibilty is to be a complete a directory as possible.

I don't think Chris should be any more liable for listing and linking to those questionable podcasts than Google is.

Are you going to call Google and tell them to remove every link to anything that suggests a white supremacist mindset? Of course not - that's silly. But censoring a podcast directory, no, that's normal.

Booooo!

YOu ignored the central tenet of my position, Patrick.

Chris is using free speech in one hand to say "free and open to all" and with the other hand, he;s slapping community members over LANGUAGE...going so far as to...get this...REMOVE THEIR POSTS. WHy? He doesn;t want to offend newbies.

Don't you think the kiddie fu@#$rs might offend? Just a little?

You honestly don't see the rank hypocrisy there? It's either free and open or it isn't. Pick a stance and stick with it.

[Patrick]

I didn't miss your point.

I'm not speaking on the subject of censoring language in the forums. Of course I don't think the forums should be censored in any way.

Just because he is making that call, doesn't mean that his decision applies to the podcast directory.

I think censoring the forums is wrong. I think censoring the directory is wrong. I've never waivered on either of those points.

They are unrelated and I believe should be treated as such.

[jimk]

They are unrelated and I believe should be treated as such.

I could not disagree with you more.

[robaustin]

I sent Adam Curry an email a few weeks ago regarding the hate speech issues, and I think this also falls into the same vein. Here is a modified version of what I wrote to Adam:

If you think about it - indiePodder.org (Podcast Alley) is a site that is open to the
public, but is built of private resrouces. I think the best way to
look at it is in a similar manner to a message board.

Say you moderate a message board - doesn't matter what kind - just any
message board. Someone posts hate speech (peodphilia) on it. As a moderator you
have some choices - you can:

1 - Leave it there.
2 - Delete it.

The argument of free speech - of an "open" directory does not necessarily apply. Sure the
person who posted the hate speech(pedophilia) message is entitled to their free
speech. Sure your message board is public. BUT - you are well within
your rights to eliminate the message as moderator.

Why would you want to do so? Because ultimately - the fallout from
leaving it up might be too great. If you leave one post up - you open
yourself up to more. Eventually as people see that you are leaving
all this relatively offensive (to your broader audience) speech up
there - they'll likely go elsewhere.

Are you infringing on the rights of the person who posts hate speech?
Not at all - they are entitled to post whatever they want - but since
your public place is funded with your own private money - you are
within your rights to set the rules of your message board.

In this same manner you are well within your rights to set rules for
indiePodder.org (Podcast Alley) - lest it become a haven for hate speech(pedophilia) podcasts. By
leaving them in you open the doors for more, and more. Why taint
your directory in that manner? The hate speech(pedophilia) podcasters will find
other places to promote themselves anyway - and anyone looking for
their kind of speech can just google it and find it anyway.

Free Speech (at least in America) is a right - but rights have limits
- and the minute that right infringes on another's right to something
else - then the limit is set. For example - I can't yell "fire" in a
crowded theater. It's a public place funded privately just like
indiepodder (Podcast Alley). My right to speaking out and saying whatever I want is
superseded by the right of everyone in that theater to be safe - and
my yelling "fire" could create a riot condition - endangering
everyone.

I really think that you shouldn't
include that podcast - because the eventuality is that the reputation
of indiePodder.org(Podcast Alley) could be hurt. Worse yet, you could incite someone
else who is so offended to take action against the site in some
malicious way - and I don't think that's a risk you should be taking.

This is not a matter of "free speech" it's about protecting the investment in the private resources that own the site - and maintaining a reputable place for the rest of the podcasters to congregate. Already some podcasters have left PCA because of the hate speech issue, and this is going to inflame things further.

Using my example above - what if the theater owner let the guy who yelled "fire" stay every time he did? People would start to get pissed, and eventually stop going to the his theater. It would be in his best interests to ban that guy from the theater so as to protect his investment in his business. And while indiepodder is a simple directory, PCA is a business and is partnered with Podshow. I hope Podshow seriously reconsiders what their business is doing.

--*Rob

[mental-escher]

Stand up in a crowded theater and yell "FIRE! FIRE!". That is "Free Speech". That’s also endangering both yourself and, more importantly, others. It is also agreed by most that it's unacceptable "Free" speech.

Hate speech is put forth to insight violence against some group of people- similar argument as above: it's wrong and should not be tolerated.

Should PCA and it's ilk list the "How to make a bomb" podcast?
Prolly not.

The "Pediphelia podcast"?
again, prolly not.

Sex among consenting adults is good, sometimes **** good! Sex with underage kiddies, rape, or sexual violence is never good, and is in fact bad. Controversial? I sure hope not.

Should PCA and it's ilk list the JimK Offensive-o-thon podcast.
Yes- JK does not endorse violence, or felonious sex crimes (correct me if I'm wrong though). It's no crime to be rude, in fact some folks make quite a successful career out of it.

BTW- You might do better to Private Message Chris (what I did) and express your view directly to him as opposed to publicly bashing his meal ticket (PCA) on HIS forums.

http://cagle.msnbc.com/news/terrorHate/hategifs/cagle00kjh.gif

[Patrick]

It's a podcast directory. Any podcast should be able to be listed.

PERIOD.

[mental-escher]

How about the "Patrick lives at 437 Grove Street in Boston MA and you should go kill him now because he's a homo jew, pedophile, democrat and an abortionaist" podcast? Should that podcast be listed??

(BTW- this was only an illustrative example, not a real podcast or a real editorial on Patrick's views).

http://gratefuldread.net/archives/nohomos.jpg

[Patrick]

I stand by my statement.

[kickasspodcast]

I think all podcasts are able to be listed.
Any podcast can be listed. That is they have
the ability to. Its not mechanically impossible
for any podcast or other kinda media to be
listed in an internet directory. So its clear that
all shows are able to be listed. I don't
think thats really the issue here

Don't you think its just a little messed up that
some perv can go to PCA and type Pedo in
the search box and within seconds find a
Pedophilia podcast and start getting his
freaky *** jones on? To me, that is a
service that PCA doesn't need to offer.


Everyone does have their own views and opinions-
nobody here is suggesting that its not ok for
people to think aweful things. The main question
is should we welcome truly harmful people into
our "community". If you were having a podcaster
party (sounds gay I know) would you invite these
guys to your house? F_ck no. Its your house, your
party. You would expect your friends to leave if
you did invite them. If you expected your friends
to come back, you wouldn't keep them around.
Its no different at PCA. The users make this forum-
we can all up and leave any **** day and
this place is instantly meaningless. This should
never be forgotten.

The mere fact that I got a message from ferf over
a day ago saying "be patient- we are working on it"-
and still nothing has been done is telling about
the seriousness in which PCA is handling these huge
problems. And why were my 1st 2 threads deleted
and not this one- was it because they didn't catch it
in time? Its never the crime, its always the cover up.


Jack B.

[Patrick]

PCA doesn't offer that service. That podcast does.

Do you blame Google because you can search for porn and find it?

No.

[Hittman]

Calling pedophilia Hate Speech is ridiculous. It is threatening speech, it is vile beyond belief, but it has nothing to do with hate speech. Hate speech is allowed in free countries, and by corporations who value free speech.

Although corporations and private business are not bound by any free speech laws, they should have very clear rules on what is and isn’t allowed.

Now, if it were me, I’d say that threats were not allowed. Threats have never been covered by free speech. If someone says “Jews are evil,” that’s not a threat, and I’d leave their show here, no matter how offensive I find it personally. However, if they say, “Let’s kill Jews,” or even “Jews should be killed,” it is a threat, and should be removed. A show that says, “women should be raped” would also be considered a threat.

Pedophilia is the rape of children. Discussing it in any kind of positive light, encouraging it in any way, is a threat, a real, honest to goodness threat against those least able to defend themselves. Therefore, it shouldn’t be listed.

But it’s not my directory, and so all I can do is offer my opinion.

Here’s another opinion for Ferf and his new trusty sidekick moderator, an opinion backed by more than a little experience. I built and ran one of the first corporate support multi-line BBSs in the country. I was the Sysop (a job that included the moderator role) of a very active forum on GEnie, as well as CompServe. I owned and operated the largest private subscription BBS in NY (outside of NYC) – a 21 line message, chat and game board, for many years, until the Internet killed it. So I’ve dealt with every kind of *****le,* spamer, trouble maker, Amway recruiter, racist, idiot and miscreant you can imagine, from the moderator’s seat. So I have just a little idea of what I’m talking about.

Moderation should be done with a very light touch, and as little as possible. You two don’t seem to understand that, and if keep doing things the way you’re doing it now, you will ruin this forum. Craig over did it, and you guys are doing an even worse job. If this is a place for grownups to have discussions, let us have grownup discussions. That means disagreements, sometimes nasty ones. Let them play out. That means cursing, for those of us who curse. That means letting people defend themselves against slander when someone lies about what they said, instead of logging in to see their defense deleted, while the slander remains in place. Step in and encourage people to behave, when necessary, but don’t do it too often, and don’t make censoring posts or moving threads your first, preferred response. Unless, of course, you want to change the name of this place to “The Puppies And Rainbows Podcast Forum,” and watch all your traffic drift away to more interesting forums.

You’ve got a great resource here, and it’s finally running well enough to be usable. Please don’t destroy it.

Stand up in a crowded theater and yell "FIRE! FIRE!". That is "Free Speech". That’s also endangering both yourself and, more importantly, others. It is also agreed by most that it's unacceptable "Free" speech.

No, it is not, and that way overused example comes from a Supreme Court decision that makes a distinction between free speech and doing something that presents a clear and present danger. Likewise, presenting a very real threat to rape children is a clear and present danger. Saying that a race is evil or lazy or stupid isn’t.

Your example of a real threat on a real person would also fall into the “not free speech” category.

Hate speech is put forth to insight violence against some group of people- similar argument as above: it's wrong and should not be tolerated.

I agree, if it is a direct incitement to violence. If it is not, if it’s just hateful rhetoric, then it must be allowed. The alternative is The Thought Police.

- - -

* There is no word in the English language that is an adequate substitute for “*****le.” The same goes for “bullshit.”

[kickasspodcast]

Man- PCA offers exactly that service.

Try going to google and typing in "pedo podcast".

Not finding much but some bits that other casters did
poking fun at these freaks.

Now trying going to the PCA search box. Type in
"Pedo". See how easy that was?

To say that the podcast offers that services is silly.
They have mp3's they upload and syndicate through XML.
They are nothing without Podcast Directory Services like PCA
that make it uber easy for people to find their sleeze.

What is really messed up is, try searching PCA for "pedophilia".
You get one result. That means that the show in question
actually used "Pedophilia" as one of their tags. Now again,
go to Google and search for "pedophilia"- what did you get?
A few links about it as mental disease, and site called
FIGHT PEDOPHILIA.

But not at PCA. All you have to do is type in "Pedo" or "Pedophila"
and you instantly find the 1 podcast regarding this subject. Now
for a 2nd test. Type in "childlove" into Google. You ain't gonna
easily find this podcast. Now try it at trusty PCA- Yes- low and
behold "childlove" brings you swiftly to this show again. If that
isn't a service what is?

So yeah- PCA does a much better job helping people find
a podcast about "childlove" than even google itself. Which
is pretty crazy when you consider how buck nasty google
is at searching.


Jack B.

PS- I am just waiting for AC to give the show's name out
and then tell people to go listen to it and ask his listeners
what they think- and then of course, slam me for telling
him it may not be a good idea to promote their show.

[mental-escher]

Do you blame Google because you can search for porn and find it?

Hell no! I personally sent them a thank you note! Sex between consenting adults is a good thing.

Calling pedophilia Hate Speech is ridiculous. It is threatening speech

yep, and as such has no place in civilized society.

[kickasspodcast]

Calling pedophilia Hate Speech is ridiculous. It is threatening speech

yep, and as such has no place in civilized society.

Exactly.

[Patrick]

Sorry to ruin both your "points", but just because Googling "pedo podcast" doesn't return results doesn't prove anything.

You can Google "pedophiles" and find all kinds of support groups and stuff full of people who are into that. Does that make Google to blame? No.

[rookiee]

Wow, guys, interesting topic.

I host a podcast called Pedologues, which openly discusses the topics of multi-generational relationships and child sexuality in America and worldwide; their effects, the pros, the cons, and its history.

People think I'm vile, disgusting, and at the very least, shocking. I merely dare to talk about the subject openly, and I'm even trying to keep a level head about the subject.

Calling pedophilia "hate speech"? I'm not sure I understand that concept. Pedophilia isn't even a verb. Calling someone who has natural, biological attractions to minors "vile digusting mofo who preys on kids"? That's hate speech.

Anyone should feel free to listen to my show and take in the conversation. I welcome it. That's what I made it for.

Remember, the same freedom of speech that I am currently utilizing is the same freedom that allows you to complain about it.

Pedophilia is not the rape of children. Pedophilia is the sexual attraction to prepubescent minors. It is also currently classified as a mental illness, just as homosexuality once was. I am not sick. I am not a "pedophile" in that frame of reference.

I am a pedosexual. I am not a criminal, and I am not vile, or disgusting.

Do I molest children? No. Do I even engage in any form of illegal activity? No.

To say that a pedosexual rapes and murders and pillages and does all these reprehensible things is ignorance. Not stupidity, mind you.

Think about it. Think about the irrationality of it. Compare it to this "Heterosexuals rape and murder and pillage and are vile, disgusting creatures because they like boobies. We must protect all women and make tons of laws to protect them and take away women's rights because they can't make proper judgements."

Think that's absurd talk? Go talk to the Taliban. They don't seem to think so.

People fear the unknown and the misunderstood. The mainstream media loves to spin on this, because it makes them money. Pedologues exists to shed light on the other side of the very tarnished coin.

All that I ask is that I be given the same playing field to do so as everybody else, and God bless anyone who thinks I have the right to do so. Liberated Syndication is one of them. I hope Podcast Alley will continue to do so as well.

Peace, out.

[AaronfromQC]

I was thinking maybe I was being a bit irrational removing this site from my blog and not being a part of this nonsense, and then I come back and find a child molestor posting on here. What the hell is going on here? Now that we have a pedofile podcast listed on here, should this site now be listed on net nanny to ensure someone's kid doesn't end up making passionate childlove or whatever the PC phrase is today with that nutcase? Will Adam Curry take a poll on this piece of crap show? Or will sanity reign supreme? Congrats Chris, you have completely destroyed your site from within. I think once Newsweek or some other mainstream publication gets word of pedophile podcasts and podnazi's, the gig is up for all of us.

[kickasspodcast]

I was thinking maybe I was being a bit irrational removing this site from my blog and not being a part of this nonsense, and then I come back and find a child molestor posting on here. What the hell is going on here? Now that we have a pedofile podcast listed on here, should this site now be listed on net nanny to ensure someone's kid doesn't end up making passionate childlove or whatever the PC phrase is today with that nutcase? Will Adam Curry take a poll on this piece of crap show? Or will sanity reign supreme? Congrats Chris, you have completely destroyed your site from within. I think once Newsweek or some other mainstream publication gets word of pedophile podcasts and podnazi's, the gig is up for all of us.


Exactly Aaron.

jack

[Wintersheart]

My 2 cents,
In my country is illegal to have Child Molesters pictures or articles on your PC or any other medium if it is illegal in the US not sure just call your police they will make him remove it you should probably stop hassling the moderator just call the coppers pretty simple, I think its beyond the joke myself.

-Lynne

[mental-escher]

My 2 cents,
In my country is illegal to have Child Molesters pictures or articles on your PC or any other medium if it is illegal in the US not sure just call your police they will make him remove it you should probably stop hassling the moderator just call the coppers pretty simple, I think its beyond the joke myself.
-Lynne

Leave it to an Aussy to put this topic into proper perspective for the "it's not MY responsibility" Yank regulars at PCA. Nicely done.


BTW Lynne - Nice podcast (http://www.ldplanet.net/) you have there too.

[Wintersheart]

Thanks mate, we are still fresh water newbies but we are having fun with it.

-Lynne

[Hittman]

Calling pedophilia "hate speech"? I'm not sure I understand that concept. Pedophilia isn't even a verb. Calling someone who has natural, biological attractions to minors "vile digusting mofo who preys on kids"? That's hate speech.

No, that is an accurate description.

You promote the rape of children. Period. You claim you haven’t done it. Not impressive. You’re promoting and encouraging it.

One nice thing about this software is that it records the IP address of anyone who posts. That means it can be used to track down criminals. Although, given your openness for your promotion of child rape, I’d be surprised if the cops weren’t watching you pretty closely already.

[kickasspodcast]

To the Mods-

If you are gonna take the time to edit pages of postings.
Why not just remove this filth from your house?

Take out the trash.

Jack B.

[kickasspodcast]

I host a podcast called Pedologues, which openly discusses the topics of multi-generational relationships and child sexuality in America and worldwide; their effects, the pros, the cons, and its history.

People think I'm vile, disgusting, and at the very least, shocking.

You are a freak. :shock:

Take your friends with you. :x

Fosco 8)

This is kickass Fosco. Too bad they will edit all of this.

MODS- If you delete this, please tell us why?
The whole Offensive link thing? What about this dude's podcast?
What about a "jew killing" podcast? Are you guys cool with them?
We heard from AC, but never from PCA. I would love to know what
you guys think of them.


Jack B.

[appy]

What an incredible thing to record for future historians...

Real-life modern day Nazi attitudes in America! Humans never change, do they?!

In 20th Century Germany, Adolf Hitler created a whole nation of Jew despising citizens.
In 21st Century USA, the mass media has created a whole nation of paedophile despising citizens!

What's the difference? None.

May God have mercy on your souls.

[jawbone]

In 20th Century Germany, Adolf Hitler created a whole nation of Jew despising citizens.
In 21st Century USA, the mass media has created a whole nation of paedophile despising citizens!

What's the difference? None.

There is a huge difference, Einstein. Last time I checked, pedophila is illegal. Your statement is absurd. That's like saying "Man, in 21st Century USA, mass media has created a whole nation of citizens who despise murderers and drug dealers." Duh. Maybe people despise it because it's (GASP!) wrong.

Oops...did I say that?

What will I will say is that in 21st century America, mass media has created a whole nation of people who refuse to take a stand against something they KNOW is wrong because either they have no backbone or they have a fear of being marginalized.

[robaustin]

Just to get back to my post - I was not saying that this specific podcast was hate speech....

I'm trying to make the greater point though, that PCA really has an obligation to itself and its investors to set limits as what should be listed. Once they decide on those limits, they should be detailed so that if someone tries to get listed but is outside of those bounds, they would know what the policy is.

Again - as a private enterprise with a public forum, it's really up to them, but the fallout from such is also up to them.

My personal opinion is that listing either a hate speech or a pedophilia podcast would probably be over the line for me - because I feel it might actually begin to create a divisiveness on the site and ultimately drive away podcasts that might be more appealing to a bulk of site visitors.

It's an editorial license I feel that PCA and indiepodder.org don't want to take on because they want to "stand for" pure freedom of speech - but realistically you have to balance that with the financial interests of your private venture. This very well could backfire (we're seeing the seeds of that now).

If the mainstream press picked up on this - on PCA carrying a hate speech or a pedophilia podcast - what would that ultimately do for the reputation of podcasting and podcasters as a whole?

As a forerunner in the podcast community and where a lot of mainstream media goes to find out about podcasts - it might even be considered irresponsible by entire podcast community to leave these things in. It might "taint" podcasting.

Yes, I know I'm, being extreme, but so is the mainstream media. They are also merciless.

Some more food for thought folks.

--*Rob

[OuterLimits]

This was taken from a similar thread on censorship:

Our search results are generated completely objectively and are independent of the beliefs and preferences of those who work at Google. Some people concerned about this issue have created online petitions to encourage us to remove particular links or otherwise adjust search results. Because of our objective and automated ranking system, Google cannot be influenced by these petitions. The only sites we omit are those we are legally compelled to remove or those maliciously attempting to manipulate our results.

We apologize for the upsetting nature of the experience you had using Google and appreciate your taking the time to inform us about it.
Note especially the key phrase: "The only sites we omit are those we are legally compelled to remove."

If a lawyer wants to take up a petition and try it in the courts it's up to them and not, thankfully, indescriminate, pandering kapos like JackB.

Oy Jack stop the 'hate', stop the pedos, stop political discussion you don't like. You can rest assured, however, that your arguement makes absolutely no sense to anyone with a working brain.

[kickasspodcast]

Oy Jack stop the 'hate', stop the pedos, stop political discussion you don't like. You can rest assured, however, that your arguement makes absolutely no sense to anyone with a working brain.

Hey Honey-

Are you holding your hair back in your avatar so you can toss your
cookies? Did you put your digicam in the bottom of your toilet seat or something? I have never said that you should be banned from forums, I haven't said that other shows should be excluded from the open discussion. I think that if we don't discuss things and try to re-educate people like yourself it only gets worse. There has been no discussion that I have tried to stop. I think I have actually done alot to bring things into light and encourage open exchange. I stand in opposition to your show and the pedocast listed in the same directory as my own show, and the shows of people who are disgusted to be on the same list as you. That's all.

You have your right to free speech, I will never do anything to limit that. But- if a private company is making money listing my site and 1000s of others, I will object to the inclusion of hate and pedophilia. I don't think thats unusual. Its called tolerance with principals. I can tolerate your running your chubby little mouth about people you are afraid of. I can tolerate a pedophile coming into the forums and getting some help or some advice on how to deal with their sickness. But I don't appreciate linking to hate sites, inflaming minorities who have done nothing to you, and inciting violence on other human beings.

Doesn't it tell you something about yourself that you are lumped in with the "Child Molester" podcast in this debate. Its you and the Child Molester vs. the rest of the world. How does it feel? Like the company you keep?

Jack B.

[OuterLimits]

I stand
in opposition to your show and the pedocast listed in the same directory as
my own show, and the shows of people who are disgusted to be on the
same list as you. That's all. Then why don't you bugger off to the kosher pickel as you've been threatening to do everyday for the last two weeks?

You have your right to free speech, I will never
do anything to limit that.
This, of course, is a bold face lie.

But- if a private company is making money listing my site and 1000s of others, I will object to the inclusion of hate and pedophilia. I don't think thats unusual. Its called tolerance. I can tolerate your running your chubby little mouth about people you are afraid of. I can tolerate a pedophile coming into the forums and getting some help or some advice on how to deal with their sickness. But I don't appreciate linking to hate sites, inflaming minorities who have done nothing to you, and inciting violence on other human beings. Thanks for the window into your demented, scurrilous mind. The connection between what we say on our show (rated way higher than your own btw) and pedophilia is a figment of your imagination. If anyone needs help it's clearly you.

Doesn't it tell you something about yourself that you are lumped in with the "Child Molester" podcast in this debate. Its you and the Child Molester vs. the rest of the world. How does it feel? Like the company you keep?
Only you are making these irrational and misplaced comparisons, but seeing that you're on your high soapbox from which to lecture us all on your moral acumen -- do carry on. I couldn't think of anything more discrediting to your own position than letting you ramble on like a madman.

Cheers,
:lol:

[Hittman]

Godwin’s Law, Appy. You just lost the argument.

Jawbone, I’d steer clear of the “It’s illegal” argument. It’s illegal to smoke a joint or download an MP3 of a hit song. If we were to kick off everyone here who has done that, this would be a very lonely place.

I think the “threats are not allowed under free speech” argument is the most effective. And since the avocation of screwing kids is a very direct threat, there should be no problem dealing with it appropriately.

If the mainstream press picked up on this - on PCA carrying a hate speech or a pedophilia podcast - what would that ultimately do for the reputation of podcasting and podcasters as a whole?

Excellent point.

[richpav]

If the mainstream press picked up on this - on PCA carrying a hate speech or a pedophilia podcast - what would that ultimately do for the reputation of podcasting and podcasters as a whole?

(I find myself attracted to this forum like a fly to a steaming pile of dog crap.)

We may soon find out. Here's the mail I sent to Xeni Jardin of Boing Boing/CNN/Wired/NPR/etc. I CC'd Adam and Chris.

Xeni,

In case you're interested...

For weeks now people in the podcasting community have been at each
others' throats over whether or not a racist podcast ("GoyFire")
should be listed in ipodder.org and podcastalley.net. The controversy
was sparked by Adam Curry asking listeners of his podcast for input on
how to handle the issue. In the end, he decided that free speech
trumps common decency.

And now, I just learned there's a podcast for pedophiles listed on
Podcast Alley: "Pedologues."

I'm a podcaster, and I want nothing to do with Podcast Alley anymore.
Over the past two weeks I've requesed three times that my podcast be
removed from their directory, but it's still there. There are a number
of podcasters who have sworn off PCA and moved to PodcastPickle.com
over this controversy.

Rich

Adam replied a few hours later:

Xeni,

As you know these issues take time to figure out after they have been identified. Podshow will state its position and actions on this tomorrow. I respectfylly ask you to await that before any publication of the issue.

Ofcourse you also have my cell number if you wish to hear the facts in Addition to Rich's viewpoint.

Clearly this is important stuff.

Regards.


...and now, ya'll can go back to ripping each other new orifices. It's a **** shame what has happened to the indy podcasting community because of this, but when you invite racists and pedophiles in, what can you expect?

In another E-mail, Adam also promised that my podcast will finally be removed from PCA. I've been asking over and over for at least a week.

[kickasspodcast]

"Until the color of a man's skin has no more signifigance than the color of his eyes, there will be war and rumors of war."

-Bob Marley
"War"

[appy]

In 20th Century Germany, Adolf Hitler created a whole nation of Jew despising citizens.
In 21st Century USA, the mass media has created a whole nation of paedophile despising citizens!

What's the difference? None.

There is a huge difference, Einstein. Last time I checked, pedophila is illegal. Your statement is absurd. That's like saying "Man, in 21st Century USA, mass media has created a whole nation of citizens who despise murderers and drug dealers." Duh. Maybe people despise it because it's (GASP!) wrong.




You're no Einstein yourself! Check better next time: Paedophilia is not illegal. It isn't illegal to be sexually attracted to minors. It isn't illegal to talk about it either. It is currently illegal to engage in sexual activity with minors under the age of consent.

Your ignorance serves to highlight how much you know about the subject which is next to nothing. That's okay, I wouldn't expect you to know much about people who rape and molest and murder, right?

Then again, that's all you see. What you're exposed to via the mass media. But have you ever heard the point of view of a child, or someone who possesses that sexual attraction but have never been in trouble with the law, or even broken it?

Of course you haven't, nor would you desire to under the current climate.

Because you don't hear the voice of someone elses point of view in this regard, do you really think that's healthy? Isn't it akin to propoganda?

In my highest opinion, you should feel worried whenever you hear only one side of any argument. It usually means there is something being hidden or supressed.

If you feel you're so right that paedophilia is wrong, what have you got to lose about someone expressing their point of view on the subject? It's only words right? What are you so afraid of, that you might hear something that makes you rethink your hard-assed principles?

You fought so hard for your free speech. You valued it so highly you made it the 1st amendment. Now you toss it aside when it suits you and say it doesn't apply. Perhaps you should be thinking really hard why you placed so much importance in it in the first place... Because when you toss it aside once, it becomes a very slippery slope from there.

Appy

PS. I find it so curious that people here have used "hate speech" and "paedophilia" as the two exceptions to permissable content in a so-called "free-speech" forum. The reason why I find it so curious is that paedophilia literally means "child-love", ironically placed in the same context as "hate speech" ...

Muggles, don't ya love em.

[jimk]

YEah, I'm sure what everyone is worried about is they might accidentally become pedophiles from listeing to scumbags talk about wanting to f@#$ little kids.

You're a god****ed GENIUS.

[appy]

YEah, I'm sure what everyone is worried about is they might accidentally become pedophiles from listeing to scumbags talk about wanting to f@#$ little kids.

You're a god****ed GENIUS.


Oh, so that's what they talk about? Are you sure about that?

Fortunately there was no free speech exclusion when being black was being a 2nd class citizen.

Fortunately there was no free speech exclusion when being homosexual was considered a mental disorder and activity illegal.

So let's start now, shall we?

[appy]

Must be tough having a mental illness.


Yep. I have the same mental illness homosexuals had 40 years ago.

Oh wait. It's not a mental illness anymore. Now I'm confused. How can something be a mental illness one day and then not a mental illness the next? Shoot. Anyway, where was I?


Anyway, I'm done with this. I can't argue with a nutjob.


After me: Lift carpet. Sweep under. Drop carpet.
Good job.


Apparently, according to Adam Curry today, you guys are history on PCA anyway. So good luck with your show and buggering little kids.


1. It isn't my show.
2. I've never buggered anyone, much less a little kid.
3. Sweeping something under the carpet doesn't make it go away. If you believe paedophilia to be your enemy, are you saying there's no worth in the term, "know your enemy?"

You might actually learn something that protects your son from these evil, evil people. Right? *wink*

[jawbone]

If you believe paedophilia to be your enemy, are you saying there's no worth in the term, "know your enemy?"

You might actually learn something that protects your son from these evil, evil people. Right? *wink*

I did listen to the show and their "discussion" and what I heard was two guys who have convinced themselves that what they're doing is right. Two guys who were explaining where the best places in this country are to find kids who would be easy prey -- er, I mean, "special friends". Two guys who were waxing philosophical about a rich history of young boy buggering and how this has gone on for years, for centuries even -- therefore it must be right!

I will agree with you about one thing. This is one hell of a slippery slope. I, for one, am going to try to get out of the way of the mudslide.

Cheers.

[jimk]

YEah, I'm sure what everyone is worried about is they might accidentally become pedophiles from listeing to scumbags talk about wanting to f@#$ little kids.

You're a god****ed GENIUS.


Oh, so that's what they talk about? Are you sure about that?

Fortunately there was no free speech exclusion when being black was being a 2nd class citizen.

Fortunately there was no free speech exclusion when being homosexual was considered a mental disorder and activity illegal.

So let's start now, shall we?

Yes, choosing to f!@# little kids is JUST LIKE BEING BLACK!

Wow. Another brilliant defense of kiddle fiddlers. Man, am I glad I don't have kids. I would literally execute some piece of filth for doing this to my child. Gladly spend my life in prison for it too.

Bottom line, though, is this crap is less offensive to PCA than swearing. Interesting, isn't it?

[theFerf]

This thread is being locked down. it has obviosuly turned into a bash-fest, which is not allowed. please refer to the FORUM POLICIES (the first post in the main forum section).

chris.