Really Bad Press - I need some help!

[camilian]

I know all press is good press, but in this article http://tinyurl.com/4ul33 I am made out to be a pervert that poops in front of children. What they are saying I did is Immoral and illegal, and not true. If they would have listened to the show in question, they would have known that it was pitch black, there were no children around, and NO one saw anything.

That said, they also screwed up the rest of the article. Final Wipe is not a sponsor, they were just nice enough to send me some product. There is a fence in my back yard, in fact two fences between me and the school, so it is not like I was pooping in the schoolyard. The reporter keeps calling the page poopcaster - which is wrong.

I love the line where I say, "Obviously, I will eventually go on to something bigger." anyone that listens to the show knows that I know I am an untalented hack. I do the show just for fun and don't believe I am ever going to be a "star" because of it. Hell I DON'T want to be a star!

I have asked the editor to correct the story online and print a retraction in the newspaper.
Please write the Arbiter and tell them the same. This could potentially cause legal issues for me and my wife could easily lose her job over it because of the profession she is in. Please help me on this one guys. Thanks.

BTW - this is not sour grapes for the bad review, I love bad reviews... but this could potentially hurt my family.

[allthewhile]

Dude, I mean no offense, but you do a show that has large segments and themes focused on pooping. I mean I'm not really worried that you're doing anything to little school children, but the fact that you do disgusting things for the sake of your show is a little childish. Shouldn't you be welcoming shock and disgust with open arms?

:roll:

In other news, that guy gets paid to write that? Phew, it seemed more like a forum post than an article.

[camilian]

Oh dude, I LOVE shock, disgust and being childish! But this guy is claiming that I am doing something that is more shocking and disgusting then I would EVER do, and is VERY illegal.

[Craig]

Chris, it should come as no surprise that I'm no fan of your show...in fact my only exposure to it was during an interview on Podcast411 and that was more than enough. But having read the article in question it's my personal opinion that unless you carry out the "experiments" in question you don't have anything to be concerned about. If you're still concerned, you may want to cover yourself by announcing in your show and on your site that the experiments were a joke and you have no intention of actually carrying them out as they would cross your own boundaries of what's appropriate. That should take care of any gray areas the reporter has opened up. (Assuming you mean it.)

Craig

[camilian]

Craig, glad to hear you don't listen to the show... would be a little hard to take you seriously if you did.
You are completely correct, I was just having a knee jerk reaction to an article that is filled with total lies and makes me out to be even more repulsive then I am.

Thanks

[notyourusualbollocks]

The Feds over there have a whole department dedicated to poop crimes don't they? Watch your back!

Seriously, it would seem that Craig's probably got the best idea. You may also want to add a disclaimer to your site and every show? Not sure how much this would help legally but it may warn people of the content.

If it does become a witch hunt, you can always migrate to the UK. We're a nation of poop and fart obsessed individuals. ;)

All the best...

MK
Not Your Usual Bollocks Music Show
www.notyourusualbollocks.squarespace.com

[GattoMedia]

1. There is a correction at the bottom of the article now.

2. About whether or not that is a sponsor, according to the transcript you said it was. So the reporter is right.

2. The only aggregious journalistic error is that the reporter stated you pooped in front of kids. You could sue on the grounds of libel, but you would have to prove that your reputation was sufficiently tarnished or that you lost business, etc.

3. I can't imagine how your wife would lose her job on this. If that were to happen you would have very good grounds for a lawsuit.

4. If you're doing this just to get publicity for your site, good job.

5. While I haven't visited your site, I would defend your right to free speech. But free speech you must remember is a two-way street.

[camilian]

1. There is a correction - I have emailed the A&E editor and thanked him for doing this. It is a bit lame... but having worked in the media I know this is how they handle retractions.

2. What transcript? What I am quoted as saying? I NEVER said most of what I am quoted. Final Wipe didn't even send me a box of product till AFTER I did the interview. He said they were a sponsor before I even knew if I liked the product or not!
This guy did the interview while watching the superbowl (I heard it in the background) told me he had not listened to the show yet, and when I told him "don't do an article on me, do it on Bandtrax and podcasting" he seemed interested and let me talk about podcasting for a good 20 minutes and then never mentions it in the article.

3. I live in a very small community and this could happen. This is truly the only thing I was mad about, I just felt I needed to show how wrong this person was all through the article.

4. She works in a job that deals with children. We live in a small town. Yes we could fight it, but if this article was not FULL of errors I would not have to.

5. Not doing this for publicity. If that were the case I would not make myself out to be a pervert. This is why I was trying to turn this guy onto podcasting. I would rather Bandtrax get the publicity then have people know about my show. My show sucks, and I know it. I would much rather have people listen to some of the great shows that are available here.

6. I agree, but when something is stated as NEWS and is inaccurate it needs to be pointed out.

[Craig]

Just out of complete curiosity, if you live in such a small community and your wife works with kids, why would you do a show like this in the first place? Wouldn't it just be a matter of time until news about the nature of your show worked its way around the community and ended up having a negative effect on your wife's job in one way or another anyway? Or do you live in a pretty liberal town?

Craig

[camilian]

I doubt me pooping would have any negative effect on my wife's job.
But pooping in front of children would.

People need to get over being scared of poop. It is one of the few things in life that everyone does. It's not like my show is perverted, it is VERY tame.

When I have interviews, we have intellectual poop discussions most of the time. I just had a guy on to talk about composting human waste, might sound like a sick idea, until you look into the facts and see that it could save lives in many third world countries.

Yes, I do "poop experiments" which are really the only edgy thing I do on the show, but they are always done in good taste.

If everyone was open about their body functions, the world would be a better place.

[Craig]

In today's society I don't take any chances when it comes to my kids, nor do any of my friends (Christian or otherwise). Without knowing what your wife does (and without knowing either of you so this isn't a personal judgement of any kind), if I were putting a son or daughter into a preschool and I found out that the teacher's husband was doing a show along the lines of what you're doing I'd probably pull my kid from her class. (If you don't have kids of your own it's a hard thing to understand.)

My point is that there's a cause and effect relationship here that you need to be mindful of, regardless of the details of this particular article.

Craig

[camilian]

Like I said, in her profession no one would care if I did a poop show.. but they would care if I pooped in front of children. Big difference.

It is sad that you would pull your child from someone's class (BTW- my wife is not a teacher) because of a internet radio show that thier husband did. Are you really that scared of society?

[PBCliberal]

The fear you see in Craig's suggestion that he'd pull his children out of a class that even tangentially touched your show is actually, in a convoluted way, a very good thing for podcasting.

Big media is running scared, thanks to conservative, usually religious activists like L. Brent Bozell III, who have used the internet to make complaining about sexual or "indecent" content almost as easy as a mouse click. (https://www.parentstv.org/ptc/fcc/fcccomplaint2.asp) The more outrage, the more fines, the greater the public distinction for shock radio fans between what they hear on AM/FM and what they hear on XM/Sirius/Podcast. The greater the distinction, the more they'll come here for material that hasn't been co-opted by the government or by people who would do what Craig claims.

Doing shocking content doesn't work unless somebody is shocked. It comes with the territory when you do your type of show. You're going to find the shocked here just like everywhere else.

[Craig]

It is sad that you would pull your child from someone's class (BTW- my wife is not a teacher) because of a internet radio show that thier husband did. Are you really that scared of society?
Like I said, if you don't have kids you won't understand. When it comes to your kids you don't take chances. It's not about being scared or shocked, it's not about religious beliefs or your right to free speech; it's about being careful. When you're in a position where you have to leave your kids with people you know very little about (such as a daycare facility) you use whatever information is available to make a decision regarding the safety of your child in that facility. It's called responsible parenting.

If you guys want to take my comments out of context and use them to get up on a soapbox about conservatives and their evil ways that's up to you, but it has nothing to do with what I'm talking about here and doing so is no different than what the reporter that caused this thread in the first place did to Chris.

My comments here were intended to be constructive and help Chris see things from a parent's perspective in a way that might help prevent negative consequences in the future. Period.

Craig

[camilian]

Hrmmm... I wasn't a bashing conservatives. I was asking that question to you directly with no consideration of your religious or political stance.

I think we are ALL more scared of things then we should be, mostly due to the way the media reports stories. You said "In today's society I don't take any chances when it comes to my kids" yet it has been proven many times that kids are safer today then when we were young. But no one wants to report that.

It's sad that for some reason we feel like we have to fear our fellow man, without first finding out more about them.

Yes, I report my poop. But I also volunteer for the Red Cross, a homeless shelter, and am on the board of a human rights organization... I have been married for 11 years to my wife, and we give a large amount of our income to charities. But people who read that article will believe I am nothing more then a pervert that likes to poop in front of children. That is the power of the press, and why they must be held in check.

[allthewhile]

play nice boys!

[Craig]

Hrmmm... I wasn't a bashing conservatives. I was asking that question to you directly with no consideration of your religious or political stance.
Actually, that was in reference to PBCliberal's comments...sorry.

It's sad that for some reason we feel like we have to fear our fellow man, without first finding out more about them.
Agreed. Where I live, however, to blindly trust everyone around me, especially with a young daughter, would be crazy.

Yes, I report my poop. But I also volunteer for the Red Cross, a homeless shelter, and am on the board of a human rights organization... I have been married for 11 years to my wife, and we give a large amount of our income to charities.
As I carefully stated in an earlier post, I don't know you and so none of my comments were meant to be taken as a judgement of you personally.

Craig

[camilian]

As I carefully stated in an earlier post, I don't know you and so none of my comments were meant to be taken as a judgement of you personally.


I didn't take your comments personally at all. I was just making the point that the article makes me look like something I am not. All because this guy wrote an incorrect story.

[Craig]

OK good. Let's just leave it at that then.

Craig

[notyourusualbollocks]

If this discussion is a microcosm of what's going on in the US in general these days then it's given me a quite fascinating insight over the last few days. ;)

MK
www.notyourusualbollocks.squarespace.com

[Craig]

No, I'd have to say it's completely unrelated. Sounds more like a British sitcom to me. :wink:

Craig

[PBCliberal]

I too am not anxious to prolong this dissention beyond its application to podcasting or our common good, but you've nailed it, NYUB. This debate is a microcosm of what we're going through over here.

Today, our House of Representatives (historically our version of the House of Commons) will most likely pass a measure to boost the maximum fine for indecency from $32,500 to $500,000. So anxious is Congress to enact this, that it passed the House Commerce Committee 46-2 last week.

The defense against pleas from people who want to listen to this material or from those who make their livings from producing it, is very similar to that offered by my esteemed colleague from Carlsbad. Wearing the most benign smile they say, "Nothing personal, mind you. We're just protecting the kids."

At least most British sitcoms end in half an hour.

[Craig]

The defense against pleas from people who want to listen to this material or from those who make their livings from producing it, is very similar to that offered by my esteemed colleague from Carlsbad. Wearing the most benign smile they say, "Nothing personal, mind you. We're just protecting the kids."
Do me the courtesy of not shoehorning me into a stereotype. Read back through my posts in this thread and show me one place where I promote censorship. In one breath you defend your right to free choice yet in the next you attack mine.

You have a right to choose what you produce, I have a right to choose what I consume.

If you want to continue this discussion feel free to email me using the email button below.

Craig

[allthewhile]

Mr. Liberal,

A little charity might do your cause well.

-jayson

[PBCliberal]

Don't put words in my mouth. Read back through my posts in this thread and show me one place where I promote censorship. In one breath you defend your right to free choice yet in the next you attack mine.

You have a right to choose what you produce, I have a right to choose what I consume.

Craig
I've put no words in your mouth. You've done an excellent job in making your point. I said the "defending the kids" argument offered by many in government, most notably Chairman Powell, is very similar to the argument you made in:

Without knowing what your wife does (and without knowing either of you so this isn't a personal judgement of any kind), if I were putting a son or daughter into a preschool and I found out that the teacher's husband was doing a show along the lines of what you're doing I'd probably pull my kid from her class. (If you don't have kids of your own it's a hard thing to understand.)

I would have hoped you would have taken the same tack with the school that you suggested for both me and the reporter. That you'd go down there and investigate, without the prejudice garnered from listening to the show produced by the husband of the person who was teaching your kids.

The upshot of all of this, is a chilling effect on freedom of expression; as you put it so eloquently: "My point is that there's a cause and effect relationship here that you need to be mindful of, regardless of the details of this particular article. "

I am, indeed trying to be charitable here, most especially to the first amendment. The courts have already found that obscenity and indecency laws are not censorship, so its legally not that kind of question. Our rights are being run over roughshod by arguments just like yours, and the rest of the world sees it pretty clearly even when we don't. That's all I'm saying here.

Produce what you want, consume what you want, but please understand that the threat to take your child out of a class because of what the spouse of a teacher does on a podcast has effects of its own. I don't think they're good effects, but reasonable people may reasonably disagree.

ON EDIT: This was posted before I saw your edit adding your generous offer to debate this in private. I think we've both made our points, I'm sure we won't change each other's minds, so I'm content to just leave it at this. Si?

[waynealanharold]

Chris Rockwell is a sick man with a sick mind! Exposing Little Billy and Sally to the sounds of (gasp!) POOPING! I say we LYNCH 'im! :lol:

All kidding aside, I'd rather leave a kid with Chris instead of the local priests! :P

[Craig]

This was posted before I saw your edit adding your generous offer to debate this in private. I think we've both made our points, I'm sure we won't change each other's minds, so I'm content to just leave it at this. Si?
Si.

Craig

[bramley]

I realize this train has sort of left the station and I'm going way off topic, but I can't resist. I'm a pretty big L-waving liberal, and the closest brush with God I've had recently is the Scottish Reform minster who married me and my husband in a hotel lobby, but more importantly I'm one of those academic liberals you hear is bullying all the college students. And since part of my research is on religious history, I can't help but address what seems to have been an unfairly pointed remark at Craig by waynealanharold about "priests." Craig, if I'm right that he's Protestant, is a the descendent of those who believed that celibacy was a deviant sexuality and thus the priests (Catholic) were deviants. Marriage and sex were part of the great reforms brought by the Protestants, and were intended to combat more immoral ways of carrying on under the cassocks. Sorry to be pedantic, but it's not only unfair to Craig to imply such things, it's completely off the mark. Point your finger in another religious direction if you must.

[waynealanharold]

I made a freakin' joke, it wasn't aimed at ANYBODY here, so please spare me the pontification.

[bramley]

I wasn't potificating, I was bullying. Hey, at least I wasn't using your tuition money to enforce my views on you. :twisted:

This whole thread, starting with a misleading article about a misinterpreted action and running through all the misunderstandings that have ensued in the discussion sums up the duplicity and limitation of language. Something we should all be aware of as folks working in a new non-visual medium.

I do hope Chris keeps us posted on further developments because I do think it's an interesting issue that bears on podcasting in general. I think we sometimes feel safer and not able to be targeted as Chris was by being "only" disembodied sound.

[notyourusualbollocks]

Sad, very sad. And I wonder what John Paul is doing on that laptop? Checking the Vatican accounts? ;)

MK

[Real-ity]

Chris,

Explain to those that matter (and you have... the people in your area via the article correction and comments) and ignore these on here that wish to judge your form of art. If some lamecasters find you "dirty"... fine. But you're the one who has a three page thread here discussing your podcast. They could only wish they had that.

Keep it flowin', and screw the lamecasters.

[radioclash]

more importantly I'm one of those academic liberals you hear is bullying all the college students.

heh. My partner John is one of those academic marxists you sometimes hear (hey he was the Evilest Man in Britain circa Daily Express 1975 once) about...he's got it right LOL. And Craig would have hated him going on television talking about cottaging when he was working at a school as a librarian...but he was supported and survived. But that was the 70's, not now. But still he lives pretty much the same way and teaches the same way, but university students...and they get their ear bended about Iraq and gay rights and all sorts of things :D

Sorry Craig, as I responded in the thread where the catholic cast (puhlease, don't you dare try and throw any stones with the history that Catholicism has got - yeah big 'C' so you could be a cast about everything but I guess not; and isn't the Catholic Church of America bankrupt through abuse cases they've lost?) guy was having a go at PCB liberal about this - and thought I should respond here - you're WAY off with the comment about taking your daughter out of schoo. You'd be way off doing that if the teacher was expressing something you didn't believe in, and double way off if it's their partner.

Next you'll tell me you don't believe in gay teachers? Puhlease.

Sorry it's censorship fair and square Craig, I've lost a lot of respect for you through that comment, you proved me right in my belief that Xtians especially church ones are all secretly bigots. Which I hope isn't true, but to me it seems the church and Xtian god teaches bigotry, it's not suprisingly really...but I'm a pessimistic optimist, I hope humanity will rise above. but try not to be too surprised when they usually don't. Sigh.

I've not (but for one) been proved wrong on that one so far...I was hoping you or someone would prove me wrong someday...in fact I know of only one person who's evangelical Xtian and seems cool to everything, but there's still time :-(

[Craig]

Well, I swore that I was done with this topic but once again what I said is being completely twisted around and made to make me look like something I'm not. So here I am again to clarify.

First, read my original comment regarding the teacher. First it was a preschool situation, not school, and second I said I'd probably pull her from the class, not the school. There is a HUGE difference (at least in this country) between preschool and regular school, on a number of levels. If we were talking grade school then no, in the same scenario I wouldn't pull her from the class. (Although, with respect to one of your other comments, as a parent I have every right to pull my child from a class if I disagree with the content and the only way it would qualify as censorship is if I try to stop the teacher from giving that class.)

As for your comments ragarding bigotry, the only bigotry I see throughout this topic is in the anti-Christian sentiment that pervades it. While I may have expressed disagreement with things that Chris is doing, there are several people, yourself included, who have expressed outright intolerance for my choices (which don't affect anyone else in this scenario) and especially for what you perceive (and I emphasize "perceive") me to be saying between the lines. Bigotry is defined by intolerance, not disagreement. However, I am also deeeply sorry for whatever negative experiences you have had in the past by people claiming to be Christians who have treated you in a way that this was not representative of Jesus.

As I said before, I would really like to take this topic offline if at all possible since it is no longer about podcasting and therefore no longer belongs in this forum. I therefore extend the same invitation to you that I extended to PCBliberal to continue our conversation via private messaging using the PM button below.

Craig

[radioclash]

Happy to take this offline...I'm sorry i said school instead of class, but I bet the effect would still be the same tho so I still stand by that.

Have to respond to this tho:

However, I am also deeeply sorry for whatever negative experiences you have had in the past by people claiming to be Christians who have treated you in a way that this was not representative of Jesus.

It's funny how many times I've heard that - oh you've just met *bad* Xtians... :roll: Sometimes you just give up...it's not intolerance but you stop giving people enough rope because your backyard is too full of people who've hung themselves on it.

Yes I'm anti-Christianity and anti-Church, not anti-people...but if someone expresses a dogma or creed (any creed) I tend to be very wary.

[camilian]

Wow... this thread got a little out of hand :)

My whole point of starting this thread was not to start a war between conservatives or liberals. It was to start a discussion on how we need to make a stand against inaccurate reporting. No matter if you agree with what I do on my show or not, I would hope you agree that I deserve the right to not have false allegations made against me.

One good thing that has come from this thread is it really shows how misunderstandings mixed with personal opinions could affect a news story.

Imagine if a reporter was doing a story on this thread and reported that Craig who is supposed to “love thy neighbor” was really scared of his. Maybe we should check into his background to see why he is so scared. Should someone that scared be allowed to preach in a church?

Or if someone reported that Wayne has something against Catholics and is an unfit parent because he would leave his children with a person who poops in front of them.

Neither of these statements is true. But they show how one person with very little journalistic integrity could make any of us out to be something we are not.

As podcasting grows we are going to get attacked by big media (this time it was just little media attacking). As proponents for free speech I would hope we could all stand up for each other’s right to podcast without having rumors spread against us.

[waynealanharold]

Speaking of "Family Values," I was surprised that Toby "high-hatted" the Jerry Springer crowd in the new podcast:

http://podcast.lurid.com/